Episode 17

full
Published on:

15th May 2024

EPISODE 17: Unbiased – A Discussion with Former NHL Referee Dave Jackson | Officiating Reform, Rule Controversies & Fan Emotions

In Episode 17 of NHL Wraparound, hosts Neil Smith and Vic Morren welcome Dave Jackson, longtime NHL referee and current ESPN Rules Analyst, for an honest, in-depth conversation about the complexities of officiating in the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

Jackson shares behind-the-scenes insight into the life of an NHL official, the transition from the single-referee to the two-man system, and the evolving use of video review. From the controversial puck-over-glass rule to hand pass restrictions and goaltender interference calls, Jackson breaks down how the rulebook is applied—and where it could evolve.

The episode also takes a critical look at offside challenges, instigator penalties, and the push to modernize officiating without compromising the speed and spontaneity of the game. The hosts then pivot to the Toronto Maple Leafs, questioning the team’s direction and cap situation as they weigh the cost of consistency versus chasing a coaching solution.

The episode closes with a powerful Human Side of the Story, where the hosts reflect on the rollercoaster of emotions that fans ride in the second round of the Stanley Cup Playoffs.

IN THIS EPISODE:

[00:41] Highlighting unexpected playoff heroes

[01:46] One-Timers: Team dynamics and trending playoff themes

[05:40] Dave Jackson joins: Refereeing in the playoffs

[14:23] Life on the road as an NHL official

[17:43] Evolution of officiating: 1-ref vs. 2-ref system

[29:20] Rule debates: penalties, challenges, and game flow

[30:10] Expanding hand pass legality across the ice

[31:37] Puck-over-glass and goal scoring nuance

[35:10] Simplifying offside reviews for officials and fans

[37:47] Adjusting instigator penalties and fighting impact

[43:50] Maple Leafs coaching and salary cap critique

[50:48] Human Side of the Story: The emotional pulse of fans in playoff hockey

KEY TAKEAWAYS:

  • Dave Jackson sheds light on the mental and physical demands of NHL officiating, especially in high-stakes playoff environments.
  • Debate around the puck-over-glass rule, offside reviews, and instigator penalties suggests the NHL rulebook may need a modern refresh.
  • Calls for rule clarity and reform are grounded in balancing fairness with preserving the integrity and flow of the game.
  • The emotional volatility of playoff fandom—especially in tightly contested series—shows how deeply connected fans are to every moment on the ice.

LISTEN & SUBSCRIBE:

Available on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, YouTube, and all major podcast platforms.

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCgBj1LV0-DMfBhcRPSJZLjA

X: https://twitter.com/NHLWraparound

Neil Smith: https://twitter.com/NYCNeil

Vic Morren: https://www.linkedin.com/in/vic-morren-7038737/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/nhlwraparound/

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@nhlwraparound

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=61555451139787

📧 Send questions or comments: NHLWraparound@gmail.com


SPONSORS & OFFERS:

🏒 MeiGray: Collect authentic game-worn jerseys at MeiGray.com. Use code WRAP10 for 10% off your order.

👖 DUER: Built for comfort and performance, save 20% with code NHLFAN at shopduer.com/NHLFAN.

💼 The Nintzel Wealth Partners: Strategic financial planning with a multigenerational perspective. Learn more at Nintzel Wealth Partners

ABOUT DAVE JACKSON:

Dave Jackson is a former NHL referee who officiated over 1,500 regular season games, 83 playoff matchups, two All-Star Games, and the 2014 Sochi Winter Olympics. Now a lead rules analyst for ESPN, Jackson brings decades of experience and perspective to some of the NHL’s most controversial calls and key moments. He is one of only six referees in NHL history to reach the 1,500-game milestone.

#NHL #Hockey #Podcast #DaveJackson #Officiating #StanleyCup #RulesAnalysis #ESPN #GoaltenderInterference #OffsideReview #PuckOverGlass #InstigatorPenalty #PlayoffHockey #FanExperience #NeilSmith #VicMorren #NHLWraparound

Next Episode All Episodes Previous Episode

Listen for free

Show artwork for NHL Wraparound Podcast

About the Podcast

NHL Wraparound Podcast
Neil Smith & Vic Morren
Breadth and depth.
Contemporary and historical.
Straight-forward and experienced.
The NHL Wraparound podcast features Neil Smith, President-General Manager of the 1994 Stanley Cup Champion New York Rangers and longtime ESPN/NHL veteran Vic Morren sharing no-nonsense opinions on news and issues around the National Hockey League.

Bringing decades of experience from their respective fields, Smith and Morren create a unique partnership that examines the NHL from multiple perspectives. Additionally, as hockey historians, the pair can delve into any topic in today’s game and enlighten the audience with connections to events from previous years. To truly appreciate where hockey stands today, one needs to understand its past.

With 2024 marking the 30th anniversary of the Rangers last championship season, a special five-part series is planned to commemorate that magical run. Expect fascinating behind-the-scenes stories and special guests with particular focus on the GM who pushed all of his chips into the middle of the table amidst the most pressurized environments – and came out on top.

Whether you’re new to the game or a seasoned fan, each episode of NHL Wraparound will leave you entertained and informed.


Bio’s
Neil S. Smith, highly regarded NHL executive, served as the President and General Manager of the 1994 Stanley Cup Champion New York Rangers. During his eleven years with the team, they achieved significant success, including three division titles, two Presidents’ Trophies, one Eastern Conference Championship, and a historic Stanley Cup victory—the franchise’s first in 54 years.

Known for his expertise in professional sports franchise economics, Smith played a pivotal role in management decisions under four different Rangers owners.. His tenure saw iconic trades and acquisitions, including Hall of Famers Mark Messier and Wayne Gretzky, as well as successful drafts and free-agent signings.

Starting as a pro scout, Smith's career highlights include the impactful 1989 draft for the Detroit Red Wings and bold trades that shaped NHL history. He briefly served as GM for the New York Islanders in 2006, later working as a consultant for the Dallas Stars, Pittsburgh Penguins, and the Mighty Ducks of Anaheim.

A Toronto native, Smith's hockey journey began in junior leagues before a distinguished college career at Western Michigan University. He has received numerous awards and distinctions, including induction into the University's Sports Hall of Fame in 1991.

Vic Morren: Born in New York City close to the Old Madison Square Garden, Vic Morren has had hockey in his blood his entire life as a fan, player and television production manager.

A graduate of William Paterson University, Morren skated for three seasons with the Pioneers hockey club and became the first statistical analyst to apply his craft to telecasts working New York Islanders and New Jersey Devils games from 1984-87. He co-authored two NHL-based statistics books within that span before moving to ESPN in 1987 and working the final season of the original deal the network had with the NHL.
After departing in 1990, Morren worked as a studio producer for SportsChannel America’s NHL coverage and the 1992 Barcelona Olympics before returning to ESPN that fall where he worked all 12 seasons on the second ESPN/NHL deal and the first season of the most recent contract in 2021-22. Morren has also earned a Sports Emmy for his work on Sunday Night Football coverage in 2003.

His relationship with Neil Smith dates back 33 years through their mutual friendship with the late ESPN/ABC commentator John Saunders. Morren looks forward to NHL Wraparound and collaborating with Smith with the goal to provide an experience of contemporary viewpoints, historical spin and an overall enriching podcast experience.